Re: [1/16] po: Update Russian translation

[Nikolay Sivov]

On 8/24/2012 10:13, Oleg Yarigin wrote:
> "To install a new program from a floppy disk, CD-ROM drive, or your hard "
>   "drive, click Install."
>   msgstr ""
> -"Чтобы установить программу с CD-ROM, дискеты или жёсткого диска, нажмите "
> -"Установить."
> +"Для установки программы с компакт- или жёсткого диска нажмите «Установить»."

You only need to fix quotation marks in original string, the variant you 
proposed doesn't say what English string is saying.
> #: appwiz.rc:62
> -msgid ""
> -"The following software can be automatically removed. To remove a program or "
> -"to modify its installed components, select it from the list and click Modify/"
> -"Remove."
> -msgstr ""
> -"Перечисленные программы можно автоматически удалить. Чтобы удалить программу "
> -"или изменить состав установленных компонентов, выберите её в списке и "
> +msgid "The following software can be automatically removed. To remove a "
> +"program or to modify its installed components, select it from the list and "
> +"click Modify/Remove."
> +msgstr "Перечисленные программы могут быть удалены. Для удаления "
> +"или изменения состава установленных компонентов, выберите их в списке и "
>   "нажмите кнопку Изменить/Удалить."

Again, don't alter original meaning, no reason to remove 'automatically' 
here.
> #: appwiz.rc:76
>   msgid "The following information can be used to get technical support for %s:"
> -msgstr ""
> -"Указанная информация может быть использована для получения технической "
> +msgstr "Указанная информация может быть использована для получения технической "
>   "поддержки приложения %s:"

Nothing changed here.
> #: appwiz.rc:35 shell32.rc:141 shell32.rc:238 regedit.rc:122 winefile.rc:104
>   msgid "Name"
> -msgstr "Имя"
> +msgstr "Название"

That's questionable. If you really want to change that it will need to 
depend on context I guess.
> #: avifil32.rc:33
>   msgid "Wine AVI-default-filehandler"
> -msgstr "Обработчик по умолчанию avi-файлов в Wine"
> +msgstr "Обработчик avi-файлов по умолчанию в Wine"

This alters a meaning a bit, now what you did means that there're some default avi-files in Wine.

[1/16] po: Update Russian translation

[Oleg Yarigin]

24.08.2012 12:20, Nikolay Sivov пишет:
> On 8/24/2012 10:13, Oleg Yarigin wrote:
> > "To install a new program from a floppy disk, CD-ROM drive, or your
> > hard "
> >   "drive, click Install."
> >   msgstr ""
> > -"Чтобы установить программу с CD-ROM, дискеты или жёсткого диска,
> > нажмите "
> > -"Установить."
> > +"Для установки программы с компакт- или жёсткого диска нажмите
> > «Установить»."
>
> You only need to fix quotation marks in original string, the variant you
> proposed doesn't say what English string is saying.

I translated so because, I hope, "floppy disc" term is obsolete nowadays 
(nobody has it).
> > #: appwiz.rc:62
> > -msgid ""
> > -"The following software can be automatically removed. To remove a
> > program or "
> > -"to modify its installed components, select it from the list and
> > click Modify/"
> > -"Remove."
> > -msgstr ""
> > -"Перечисленные программы можно автоматически удалить. Чтобы удалить
> > программу "
> > -"или изменить состав установленных компонентов, выберите её в списке и "
> > +msgid "The following software can be automatically removed. To remove
> > a "
> > +"program or to modify its installed components, select it from the
> > list and "
> > +"click Modify/Remove."
> > +msgstr "Перечисленные программы могут быть удалены. Для удаления "
> > +"или изменения состава установленных компонентов, выберите их в
> > списке и "
> >   "нажмите кнопку Изменить/Удалить."
>
> Again, don't alter original meaning, no reason to remove 'automatically'
> here.

What does it mean: "можно автоматически удалить"? It doesn`t sound 
correct becouse auto-removing (in the text) and user-aided one (in mean 
of a phrase "можно удалить") are mutual exclusive.
> > #: appwiz.rc:76
> >   msgid "The following information can be used to get technical
> > support for %s:"
> > -msgstr ""
> > -"Указанная информация может быть использована для получения
> > технической "
> > +msgstr "Указанная информация может быть использована для получения
> > технической "
> >   "поддержки приложения %s:"
>
> Nothing changed here.

I thout the first empty line is obsolete, exclude console "table-layout" 
output.
> > #: appwiz.rc:35 shell32.rc:141 shell32.rc:238 regedit.rc:122
> > winefile.rc:104
> >   msgid "Name"
> > -msgstr "Имя"
> > +msgstr "Название"
>
> That's questionable. If you really want to change that it will need to
> depend on context I guess.

I think, "Имя" is used for, em, "animate objects"; against "Название"
is used for "inanimate objects".
> > #: avifil32.rc:33
> >   msgid "Wine AVI-default-filehandler"
> > -msgstr "Обработчик по умолчанию avi-файлов в Wine"
> > +msgstr "Обработчик avi-файлов по умолчанию в Wine"
>
> This alters a meaning a bit, now what you did means that there're some
> default avi-files in Wine.

I wrote so becouse "Обработчик avi-файлов по умолчанию" in my opinion is 
more correct when "Обработчик по умолчанию avi-файлов", because this 
style is used in Windows. But I don`t know, where "в Wine" need to be, 
really.

Thank you a lot for your critique. If we willn`t go to one opinion, I`m 
ready to undo these edits.

---

Oleg.

[1/16] po: Update Russian translation

[Nikolay Sivov]

On 8/25/2012 09:43, Oleg Yarigin wrote:
> 24.08.2012 12:20, Nikolay Sivov пишет:
> > On 8/24/2012 10:13, Oleg Yarigin wrote:
> > > "To install a new program from a floppy disk, CD-ROM drive, or your
> > > hard "
> > >   "drive, click Install."
> > >   msgstr ""
> > > -"Чтобы установить программу с CD-ROM, дискеты или жёсткого диска,
> > > нажмите "
> > > -"Установить."
> > > +"Для установки программы с компакт- или жёсткого диска нажмите
> > > «Установить»."
> >
> > You only need to fix quotation marks in original string, the variant you
> > proposed doesn't say what English string is saying.
>
> I translated so because, I hope, "floppy disc" term is obsolete 
> nowadays (nobody has it).

This is not up to translator to alter a meaning of original text just 
cause some words in it are not
used frequently enough these days than they used to.
> > > #: appwiz.rc:62
> > > -msgid ""
> > > -"The following software can be automatically removed. To remove a
> > > program or "
> > > -"to modify its installed components, select it from the list and
> > > click Modify/"
> > > -"Remove."
> > > -msgstr ""
> > > -"Перечисленные программы можно автоматически удалить. Чтобы удалить
> > > программу "
> > > -"или изменить состав установленных компонентов, выберите её в 
> > > списке и "
> > > +msgid "The following software can be automatically removed. To remove
> > > a "
> > > +"program or to modify its installed components, select it from the
> > > list and "
> > > +"click Modify/Remove."
> > > +msgstr "Перечисленные программы могут быть удалены. Для удаления "
> > > +"или изменения состава установленных компонентов, выберите их в
> > > списке и "
> > >   "нажмите кнопку Изменить/Удалить."
> >
> > Again, don't alter original meaning, no reason to remove 'automatically'
> > here.
>
> What does it mean: "можно автоматически удалить"? It doesn`t sound 
> correct becouse auto-removing (in the text) and user-aided one (in 
> mean of a phrase "можно удалить") are mutual exclusive.

It means that there's an uninstaller of some sort that could be used to 
uninstall a program. Uninstall doesn't mean removing files, it could be 
a lot more. So user can manually undo what's done by installer (and he's 
not supposed to do that) or automatically undo these changes going 
through uninstallation procedure.
> > > #: appwiz.rc:35 shell32.rc:141 shell32.rc:238 regedit.rc:122
> > > winefile.rc:104
> > >   msgid "Name"
> > > -msgstr "Имя"
> > > +msgstr "Название"
> >
> > That's questionable. If you really want to change that it will need to
> > depend on context I guess.
>
> I think, "Имя" is used for, em, "animate objects"; against "Название"
> is used for "inanimate objects".

That's not true. It's more general than that, it's more like 
"identifier" actually. And nobody says "название файла", that
sounds strange at least.

[1/16] po: Update Russian translation

[Oleg Yarigin]

25.08.2012 11:50, Nikolay Sivov пишет:
> On 8/25/2012 09:43, Oleg Yarigin wrote:
> > 24.08.2012 12:20, Nikolay Sivov пишет:
> > > On 8/24/2012 10:13, Oleg Yarigin wrote:
> > > > "To install a new program from a floppy disk, CD-ROM drive, or your
> > > > hard "
> > > >   "drive, click Install."
> > > >   msgstr ""
> > > > -"Чтобы установить программу с CD-ROM, дискеты или жёсткого диска,
> > > > нажмите "
> > > > -"Установить."
> > > > +"Для установки программы с компакт- или жёсткого диска нажмите
> > > > «Установить»."
> > >
> > > You only need to fix quotation marks in original string, the variant you
> > > proposed doesn't say what English string is saying.
> >
> > I translated so because, I hope, "floppy disc" term is obsolete
> > nowadays (nobody has it).
>
> This is not up to translator to alter a meaning of original text just
> cause some words in it are not
> used frequently enough these days than they used to.

Well, in this case I`ll improve it to "... с дискеты, компакт- ...".
> > What does it mean: "можно автоматически удалить"? It doesn`t sound
> > correct becouse auto-removing (in the text) and user-aided one (in
> > mean of a phrase "можно удалить") are mutual exclusive.
>
> It means that there's an uninstaller of some sort that could be used to
> uninstall a program. Uninstall doesn't mean removing files, it could be
> a lot more. So user can manually undo what's done by installer (and he's
> not supposed to do that) or automatically undo these changes going
> through uninstallation procedure.

In this case we need to change this phrase, becouse it messed everybody I
asked. What is in Windows there (for reference)?
> > > > #: appwiz.rc:35 shell32.rc:141 shell32.rc:238 regedit.rc:122
> > > > winefile.rc:104
> > > >   msgid "Name"
> > > > -msgstr "Имя"
> > > > +msgstr "Название"
> > >
> > > That's questionable. If you really want to change that it will need to
> > > depend on context I guess.
> >
> > I think, "Имя" is used for, em, "animate objects"; against "Название"
> > is used for "inanimate objects".
>
> That's not true. It's more general than that, it's more like
> "identifier" actually. And nobody says "название файла", that
> sounds strange at least.

Oh, I forgot about it. But there is an "Имя" column in Windows Explorer 
(in Windows 7 at least), so I don`t know what is correct.

[1/16] po: Update Russian translation

[Francois Gouget]

On Sat, 25 Aug 2012, Oleg Yarigin wrote:
> > > I translated so because, I hope, "floppy disc" term is obsolete
> > > nowadays (nobody has it).
> >
> > This is not up to translator to alter a meaning of original text just
> > cause some words in it are not
> > used frequently enough these days than they used to.

Note however that if a translator finds something wrong in the English 
string he is welcome to either send a patch to fix it (in the RC file 
and if pretty sure of the change), or raise the issue on wine-devel (if 
the change is more questionable).

By doing so you not only improve your translation, but also the English 
version and all the other translations. And really, only the 
translators, by force, make a complete and thorough review of Wine's 
messages. So if they don't contribute fixes to the English version, 
nobody will.

[1/16] po: Update Russian translation

[Oleg Yarigin]

Nikolay,

Can you tell me, why these line of patches is applied very slow? I 
prepared a patch file, which contains improvements by our dialog, but I 
can`t apply it until my another patches are applied.

---

Oleg